Re: [PHP-DEV] The @@ is terrible, are we sure we're OK with it?

  111152
July 23, 2020 15:19 pollita@php.net (Sara Golemon)
On Thu, Jul 23, 2020 at 1:26 AM Mark Randall <marandall@php.net> wrote:

> On 23/07/2020 02:00, Sara Golemon wrote: > > Regards the vote; I don't believe that @@ has been proven unworkable, > > however if I'm wrong about that, then the second choice selection from > the > > last vote would obviously take precedence. > > I don't believe the concern is that we have something unworkable sitting > in front of us right now, after all if that were the case we would not > be needing to have this conversation as the RFC would already have been > rendered void. > > What we do have, is a deep sense of unease that we collectively made the > wrong decision, based on, in part, incomplete information. > > If that's the case, then the solution still seems obvious: Defer attributes
to 8.1. I know a LOT of people will not be happy about that, but it's the most responsible thing to do if the threat of forking up is that present and that dangerous. There are plenty of cool new toys coming in 8.0, we can save something for 8.1 and get it *right* instead of shooting ourselves in the collective foot. -Sara
  111158
July 23, 2020 16:45 pollita@php.net (Sara Golemon)
On Thu, Jul 23, 2020 at 10:19 AM Sara Golemon <pollita@php.net> wrote:

> If that's the case, then the solution still seems obvious: Defer > attributes to 8.1. > > After some discussion off list, including Nikita (who is probably closer to this "problem" than any of the rest of us), I think the best way forward
at the moment is to proceed with the voted on action: Merge attributes using @@ syntax prior to the feature freeze date. However, with my RM hat on, I need to feel like we're as sure as we can be about this syntax before it's public. I'm willing to extend an additional period (up to the tagging of beta3, in just under six weeks) for a re-vote on the syntax as changing that will be less violent of a change than merging the entire implementation after branching. I hope this solution is both procedurally appropriate and satisfactory to all. -Sara
  111216
July 28, 2020 13:31 nikita.ppv@gmail.com (Nikita Popov)
On Thu, Jul 23, 2020 at 6:46 PM Sara Golemon <pollita@php.net> wrote:

> On Thu, Jul 23, 2020 at 10:19 AM Sara Golemon <pollita@php.net> wrote: > > > If that's the case, then the solution still seems obvious: Defer > > attributes to 8.1. > > > > After some discussion off list, including Nikita (who is probably closer > to this "problem" than any of the rest of us), I think the best way forward > at the moment is to proceed with the voted on action: Merge attributes > using @@ syntax prior to the feature freeze date. >
Done. However, with my RM hat on, I need to feel like we're as sure as we can be
> about this syntax before it's public. > I'm willing to extend an additional period (up to the tagging of beta3, in > just under six weeks) for a re-vote on the syntax as changing that will be > less violent of a change than merging the entire implementation after > branching. >
So, does anyone plan to pursue this? Nikita
  111217
July 28, 2020 13:46 joe@joeferguson.me (Joe Ferguson)
On 7/28/2020 08:31, Nikita Popov wrote:
> However, with my RM hat on, I need to feel like we're as sure as we can be >> about this syntax before it's public. >> I'm willing to extend an additional period (up to the tagging of beta3, in >> just under six weeks) for a re-vote on the syntax as changing that will be >> less violent of a change than merging the entire implementation after >> branching. >> > So, does anyone plan to pursue this? > > Nikita
Yes. I'll have an RFC to announce shortly. Waiting on one last review before sharing here.